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Post by mikeguth on Mar 19, 2006 19:17:03 GMT -5
Gee, I start posting to these boards and now no one seems to answer. Hope I didn't say anything offensive or too stridently.
Now, to the subject. I've played with and against Phelan Ward in 2 events, and I think he is BIG TROUBLE, especially for the anti-Twin armies that depend on a big mech. The odds of having Zellbringen occur in the first four turns are better than 50%. Then, there is nothing more amusing than watching a mech heat up trying to get a non-indirect shot at Phelan. In 450 it can be tight, but you can play him with Twins. Imagine getting to march the Twins up right next to the Loki/Solitude/CNC Nova Cat to engage its support without the mech being able to even glance at you as you base him.
If you Zellbring the twin without pulse, its not a walkover either, the Twin is likely to take 3-6 damage back depending on circumstances.
Could Phelan be a useful Anti-Twin piece? Have to investigate what one could bring in support.
The game seems to me now to be quite broken, since you need either TWINS, and maybe Phelan to play. And, the Med. Double Rate card is getting close to $50 on ebay.......(Damocles for 9 perhaps?).
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Post by Zxqueb on Mar 19, 2006 19:30:44 GMT -5
Mike,
You certainly didn't do anything offensive. This board is usually quiet on the weekends. I'm glad you are here and posting! If I am quiet on the subject of the twins, it's just that I am rather sick of thinking about / discussing them at the moment.
As for Phelan... I think the twin still has the advantage as he will get more than one turn in a row. The only thing Phellan has going for him is his insanely stable attack. But a twin will be able to charge (needing an 8) + fire (needing a 6), doing 6 damage in one turn to phelan. If the twin is on green heat, he isn't in heat trouble really. I know some big name players are touting his effectiveness, but I just don't see it. He is too vulnerable in an anti twins role. In a lock down a big mech role, he would do ok as long as he has evade and hits his pilot ability early. But still, with his pilot and evade, he's ringing in at only slightly cheaper than a considerably more effective big mech. Not to mention that Phelan is still vulnerable to artillery as well as some more esoteric things (m-pods / Mule kick).
I agree that the twins have broken the metagame, but I am hopeful that in the next week or two we will see another twin nerf. I think the game is quite balanced when they are not a factor in the tournament pool.
Z
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Post by mikeguth on Mar 19, 2006 22:25:27 GMT -5
You are of course correct in that the Twins can strike at Phalen quickly, and it costs alot,too much, to give him evade. But, Phalen has the same charge reach as a Twin himself. Against Twins plus Kelswa/WH drop my question is whether my 308 points could deal with one Twin and one Kelswa drop faster than Phalen would die. At least its a consideration. I'll report back.
Glad to hear that the Twins may get shaved again. Otherwise, what is the point of actually buying boosters or any other figures for that matter.
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Post by baw on Mar 20, 2006 8:32:29 GMT -5
I am usually busy on weekends also  Playing MW! Phelan is a gamble in my opinion. I have played whole games with Caustic and neither has rolled it. You have a 50% in 4 turns. That isn't a very likely. That is a great point Mikeguth. At least I don't have to buy lots of MW figures now.. All we need is the twins. We need to put that in our logos at WK. That would grab some attention. If the only figures we need to buy is twins then we certainly don't need to buy any boosters. |
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Post by dragondawg on Mar 20, 2006 12:54:32 GMT -5
I'm sure you did not offend anyone. I check these boards when I have a few minutes during my planning period (I teach) and don't always have time to post back. I've never been a big poster either. I try to read on mwrealms and the wizkids forums everyday, but I don't post much there either. Mostly its because I respect everyone's opinions and try not to go against anyone's thoughts. In other areas of my life it is the same way. I avoid confrontation, hate to argue, and (as long as it won't hurt them and doesn't compromise who I am) bow to others' ideas.
I think you have some great ideas, Mike! If I thought I had any great ideas, I'd post em too. I usually build armies in my head on the way to tourneys and forget about them after the tourney *shrug*
"If I have seen a little further it is by standing on the shoulders of Giants." - Sir Isaac Newton
And if I've had success in Mechwarrior it is because of help and posts of people like you, Mike.
My Nationals and Worlds UR winning armies are tweaked versions of one of Zxqueb's.
So please keep posting. For what it is worth, know that I read and respect what you have to say.
While I'm here: on Phelan-
Twins plus Phelan with Evade would be a nighmare. Thankfully it is a few points over.
Twins plus Phelan with Grapple is pretty nasty in itself. Someone crunch the numbers and see if another grapple unit could fit in that army, or a combat tech.
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Post by baw on Mar 21, 2006 7:38:25 GMT -5
I guess I will crunch some of those numbers tonight. It does sound like a nasty idea! Lets see... Twins Phelan evade merc pride this is what is in store for 600 for us!
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Post by baw on Mar 22, 2006 22:19:29 GMT -5
twin and solitaire with phelan and a grapple for a light mech equals 449. Light grapple being 15. Cheapest grapple unit is 18.. (which is the WH simians)
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Post by Zxqueb on Mar 23, 2006 9:16:16 GMT -5
That's definitely a solid build, Baw. The nice thing about phelan + grapple is that if he hits his ability, you can use him to grapple other units besides his target (like tank drops and the like which could hurt the twins). That can potentially keep him moderately safe.
Z
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Post by baw on Mar 23, 2006 13:10:32 GMT -5
oooh that is so baaddd.
Ok so Phelan ties up a tank drop/Sizable mech. One of the twins bases phelan's target mech so he can't shoot at phelan and one twin destroys whatever is left over.. Sounds good in theory but there are a lot of circumstances that need to be done but it does sound really nasty.
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Post by Republic's Fury on Apr 5, 2006 19:08:27 GMT -5
Using HRs I've come up with a gear that neuters the Twins.
Now I know that most people don't play at home, however keep in mind that if you're the BM and you don't break the rules you can use HRs on Unrestricteds and always on Venue sponsored. If anyone's interested I'll post up the gear.
The other thing I did was come up with a gear that neuters the gear I came up with so you can still take the Twins...oh the tangled web we weave.... ;D
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Post by baw on Apr 6, 2006 6:33:30 GMT -5
I tried Twins and Phelan with IT in my last constructed game. It worked very well! Rolling a 6 on first roll against solitude was very depressing to my opponent (I used his die though)
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Playing MW! 
